No event notifications and reliability of detection?

[alfaclvi]

I was so confused yesterday that I didn't notice that the blue bell or siren icon was greyed out

 

[Ianc]

@Ianc. It seems that it's not so much missing notifications but missing events from what you're describing. I'd try to diagnose and adjust your detection settings to see whether you can get more reliable triggers. On your Hik-Connect app go to:

Me > Settings and turn on 'Display VCA Rule'. That will allow you to walk test your alarms, enabling you to see on your phone screen when it is/isn't triggering. The overlay helps you make adjustments as necessary. If you're using both intrusion and line crossing, to avoid confusion I'd probably switch one off while testing the other, as there'll be a lot to decipher on screen.

Thanks again @JB1970 Good to see that @alfaclvi got his issue sorted.

I have tried the Display VCA Rule again this morning.
Walk testing each camera, I am highlighted by the green box which turns red when I enter the detection areas or cross the lines and I get the push notification.

As I mentioned, the two ColorVu cameras which are giving me the problem are G3 and, despite only being purchased two-ish years ago, are now EOL and are getting no further firmware updates, the last being v5.5.820_231108 which is installed on both.

The other camera is a 2366G2 on the latest v5.7.14 firmware. I have no evidence of anyone entering the garden so without checking hours of footage I assume that camera is working ok.

So I am now thinking as there are no event logs on the NVR, it must be the cameras at fault, so checking firmware I came across >this post< which has got me thinking, is it a firmware issue?
The portal lists v5.5.800 as the latest even though there is a v5.5.801

 

[JB1970]

Thanks again @JB1970 Good to see that @alfaclvi got his issue sorted.

I have tried the Display VCA Rule again this morning.
Walk testing each camera, I am highlighted by the green box which turns red when I enter the detection areas or cross the lines and I get the push notification.

As I mentioned, the two ColorVu cameras which are giving me the problem are G3 and, despite only being purchased two-ish years ago, are now EOL and are getting no further firmware updates, the last being v5.5.820_231108 which is installed on both.

The other camera is a 2366G2 on the latest v5.7.14 firmware. I have no evidence of anyone entering the garden so without checking hours of footage I assume that camera is working ok.

So I am now thinking as there are no event logs on the NVR, it must be the cameras at fault, so checking firmware I came across >this post< which has got me thinking, is it a firmware issue?
The portal lists v5.5.800 as the latest even though there is a v5.5.801

I don't think it's necessarily a firmware issue. I have 5.5.820 on two G3's and reliably have line crossing working in darkness I think potentially the detection is not working as well in darkness as that's when the detections were missing from your logs. As inconvenient as it is, it would be probably best to walk test and adjust your detection setup during darkness when the cameras seem to be less sensitive. One thing of note in your images posted of missed events was the reflection from the high viz clothing and that reflection causing the rest of the body in view to appear darker.

I do think often that CCTV users expect too much of motion detection, line crossing, AcuSense etc. The camera is for capturing images and all detection is really just a convenience feature. False alerts and missed alerts are to be expected regardless of how well set up the camera is, as it's just an algorithm and is not perfect. If I wanted reliable external detection I'd be using dedicated motion detectors - PIRs, active infra red beams etc. Tri-tech external detectors are available that you mount at around 1.2m AFL. They have a PIR that goes out and down (could false alert with cats, foxes), a PIR that goes out and up (could false alert with birds) and a central microwave. But all three have to be active simultaneously to trigger an alert.

 

[alfaclvi]

nothing at all for the milkman at the front Door at 04.02

Can you find the milkman on NVR GUI Playback, Normal or Event search by Rules and can you also find him on IVMS4200 Remote Playback search by Rules or Event playback?

 

[JB1970]

Can you find the milkman on NVR GUI Playback, Normal or Event search by Rules and can you also find him on IVMS4200 Remote Playback search by Rules or Event playback?

I think it's the guy with the anti CCTV high viz coat in the image further up the thread. Potentially the reflection could contribute to the camera not perceiving the object as Human...

 

[alfaclvi]

Potentially the reflection could contribute to the camera not perceiving the object as Human...

This happens many times for me too. The problem should be if this size "target" is not detected at all. The issue I had before reset
That's why I feel safe using Search by rules, at least for night time.....

 

[Ianc]

Yes the milkman is in a hi-viz jacket. I was wondering if that would have an impact.
But It's not just in darkness, the camera failed to detect a DHL delivery in the middle of the day, post mid morning and my wife leaving at 7.15am.
If you look at the third screenshot in post #3 that was completely missed.

I'll continue to play around with the settings.

 

[alfaclvi]

Your middle of the day issue reminds me my issues with no Detection area in front and till the middle of camera image.
The solution for me was:

1. Delete camera from NVR, so that the settings of that specific camera are deleted.(or reset NVR)
2. Reboot the NVR,
3. Reset camera,
4. Activate and Add camera again,
5. do all the Motion and Smart Event settings from NVR and select By Camera, so that the camera does the processing and sent metadata to NVR.
6. Do not save anything about Events, from camera GUI settings iVMS or Browser. Do other settings but not Events
7. Do not enable Platform Access for the camera on Camera settings.

I don't know which from above was the reason. That could be the reset or the Events done from NVR or the Platform Access. I start to believe it was the Platform Access and Hik-Connect, which is not necessary since we can use the Platform Access for the NVR as @JB1970 mentioned above. If Platform Access is enabled for this camera, there are some region and detection settings set from Hik-Connect and those could alter settings previously set from NVR or Camera GUI. These setting do not exist for the NVR that is added to Hik-Connect. Only cameras have them.

 

[Ianc]

okay. I tried to follow your step by step solution.

1. Not sure what you meant by delete the camera from NVR (the camera management tab on the NVR GUI won’t let you delete the channel despite having a ‘delete’ option)
2. Reboot NVR
3. Reset camera to factory default
4. Camera activated and re-added (via plug&play)
5. Smart event intrusion detection settings configured on NVR (cannot find the 'By Camera' setting?)
6. Only saved events on the NVR but via browser as the re are no smart events available directly on NVR.
7. Platform Access only enabled on NVR

Walk tested the detection area and getting notifications.
Will walk test again later in the dark

 

[alfaclvi]

You performed the right procedure.
I don't know if delete is possible. Maybe power off camera, then delete offline camera, power off NVR.
Below is where is my selection for VCA By Camera or VCA by NVR

 

[Ianc]

Hi @alfacivi you must have a different NVR as I don't have the 'SMD Events' sub-section under the 'Event' tab.

I've also noticed on the reset cam that I no longer get markers in the timeline for movement outside the detection area. Maybe the algorithm needs to re-learn

 

[alfaclvi]

Hi @Ianc

Yes this is different. Mine is an Accusense K series

If your NVR is an M series then the similar setting is AI by NVR enable or disable.
I don't know the model but an example is here at page 50:

https://www.hikvision.com/content/dam/hikvision/products/S000000001/S000000132/S000000007/S000000008/OFR009766/M000060964/SM000061899/User_Manual/UD36044B_Network-Video-Recorder_User-Manual_V5.01.060_20240102.PDF

About markers, if you mean the green rectancles when viewing image on browser live view, then in camera settings, Local tab, you must enable Display Rules Information.
On NVR there must be a button to enable disable for live view. On iVMS4200 settings you must Enable VCA rule, Enable Highlight and Display Target's Pattern

 

[Ianc]

It is the M series. I'm wondering now if the 'AI by NVR' setting that you refer to is only in the v5 GUI as there is no 'Event Center' in the v4 GUI
(I'm still on v4.63.025 until the v5 issues on release are confirmed resolved)

The timeline event markers I am referring to are detailed in 'this thread'

 

[alfaclvi]

Is there an option for Expert or Easy Mode on 4.63.025 firmware?

If you mean Motion markers then Motion Detection must be enabled for all image area, even if you do not want notifications. This works for me and my camera-NVR. I can not be sure about your NVR. An expert installer could give you better advice with that.

 

[Ianc]

If you mean Motion markers then Motion Detection must be enabled for all image area, even if you do not want notifications. This works for me and my camera-NVR. I can not be sure about your NVR. An expert installer could give you better advice with that.

Doh...
I've just checked this and sure enough, resetting the camera has unchecked 'Enable Motion Detection' and 'Enable Dynamic Analysis for motion' under Basic Event

 

[johnfitzy]

I'm still on v4.63.025 until the v5 issues on release are confirmed resolved

The Hik-connect stuttering playback has been fixed in the latest release V5.02.005 build 240318... and @stuhope123 's doorbell connected with this release as well... maybe time to give it a shot?

 

[Ianc]

Is there an option for Expert or Easy Mode on 4.63.025 firmware?

No.... that is a new feature of GUI 5
Looks like I need to take a leap of faith.....

 

[JB1970]

No.... that is a new feature of GUI 5
Looks like I need to take a leap of faith.....

Easy Mode isn't on V5 of the M Series. I wish it didn't exist on any model as it's stupid having to switch between two different screens for different elements of the same configuration. I've yet to find it of any use; inevitably you access a page in any menu heading while in 'Easy Mode' and find yourself switching to 'Expert' to check what you might have missed. It's been available on many of the K and M series DVRs for some time and all of the NXI-K model NVR's.

It is the M series. I'm wondering now if the 'AI by NVR' setting that you refer to is only in the v5 GUI as there is no 'Event Center' in the v4 GUI
(I'm still on v4.63.025 until the v5 issues on release are confirmed resolved)

AI by NVR isn't on the M series at all unless you have the NXI model of the M series (without NXI NVR, AcuSense can only be carried out on the AcuSense camera). If you did it would be on both V4 and V5 firmwares

 

[Ianc]

After spending the week walk testing and tweaking the detection areas, adjusting threshold and sensitivity values, the camera is still managing to miss a glaringly obvious human walking into the detection area, loitering by the letterbox for a few seconds and walking back out again at 11.23am in full daylight.

I’m going to update the NVR to V5 now that the major release issues have been addressed.
At least you no longer have to log into the individual cameras to adjust the display settings, exposure, day/night switch, backlight settings etc… as with V5, these settings are now accessible directly from the NVR via Device Access>Device Configuration>Device Parameter.

I can’t see this making a difference though as the camera didn’t send any info to the NVR, (no event logs for the time period around 11.23) so the NVR has no info to send to Hik-Connect!

I appreciate that there will be always be 'some' false detections and some ‘missed’ alerts but to miss an obvious person in daylight suggests there has to be some setup issue at play, I just can’t seem to figure it out.

I’m considering whether or not to replace the G3 ColorVu camera with a G5 varifocal in order to get more area of interest in the full field of view, an added bonus is it will also have firmware updates.

 

[JB1970]

After spending the week walk testing and tweaking the detection areas, adjusting threshold and sensitivity values, the camera is still managing to miss a glaringly obvious human walking into the detection area, loitering by the letterbox for a few seconds and walking back out again at 11.23am in full daylight.

I’m going to update the NVR to V5 now that the major release issues have been addressed.
At least you no longer have to log into the individual cameras to adjust the display settings, exposure, day/night switch, backlight settings etc… as with V5, these settings are now accessible directly from the NVR via Device Access>Device Configuration>Device Parameter.

I can’t see this making a difference though as the camera didn’t send any info to the NVR, (no event logs for the time period around 11.23) so the NVR has no info to send to Hik-Connect!

I appreciate that there will be always be 'some' false detections and some ‘missed’ alerts but to miss an obvious person in daylight suggests there has to be some setup issue at play, I just can’t seem to figure it out.

I’m considering whether or not to replace the G3 ColorVu camera with a G5 varifocal in order to get more area of interest in the full field of view, an added bonus is it will also have firmware updates.

I can see you posted a couple of screenshots from the two cameras earlier on in the thread. Are you able to screenshot and post the detection areas or lines that you've drawn? Intrusion detection normally needs space around the detection area (IE not full screen) so that the target is in view outside of the defined area before moving into it (in order for the camera to determine the size of the target is between min and max, is human etc). That's similar with line crossing where it will always works best for targets moving across the line left/right rather than moving toward/away from the camera. Obviously we are restricted as to where cameras can be physically mounted but if we can't set up line or intrusion as required for correct operation, motion detection is going to work better.